"Christianity"

[Lilypool]

Jul 22, 2013 0:11:48 GMT -6 Hawktalon said:

I disagree with this simply because I've seen many straight people turn gay and gay people turn straight, though the latter Ive seen once while the former, several.

But I suppose that's an entirely different debate.

Straight people do not "turn" gay. It's more of a realization - they realize that they were gay all along. Some people contemplate this for months (or years) - others find that they're attracted to the same sex through a *cough* picture, or through getting a developed feeling for a friend, acquaintance, etc. Developed, obviously, meaning what you'd feel for a woman, Alex. Or, generally, what straight men feel for a woman. It's not a choice and that comes from someone who is gay.

[Hawktalon]

Jul 22, 2013 21:11:31 GMT -6 Lilypool said:

Jul 22, 2013 0:11:48 GMT -6 Hawktalon said:

I disagree with this simply because I've seen many straight people turn gay and gay people turn straight, though the latter Ive seen once while the former, several.

But I suppose that's an entirely different debate.

Straight people do not "turn" gay. It's more of a realization - they realize that they were gay all along. Some people contemplate this for months (or years) - others find that they're attracted to the same sex through a *cough* picture, or through getting a developed feeling for a friend, acquaintance, etc. Developed, obviously, meaning what you'd feel for a woman, Alex. Or, generally, what straight men feel for a woman. It's not a choice and that comes from someone who is gay.

Then how come it's only gay people who realize that they're gay? Like I said I've seen only one time a person become straight, and I don't even think it was straight I think he became bi. If it was a realization then why are virtually /only/ straight people becoming gay?

Lilypool

[Forestbreak]

Because you grow up assuming you're straight like everyone else. You don't realize you're gay and then realize you're straight again.

[Blasphemy]

It's not only gay people that realize they're gay. I understand it seems that way. But, why? Because heterosexuality is the norm in the world. Upon hearing a woman's name, without prior knowledge, one would expect her to be heterosexual. (Of course, this is a generalization. I recognize that some people are different.) Ditto with men. If this world was different, if it was expected that a man or woman could be either or, then it wouldn't seem as if only gay people make this realization.

[Hawktalon]

But it still doesn't make sense. My friend Ryan who used to be straight who recently turned gay two years ago. He dated a friend of mine, made out with her, and told her he loved her, they dated about a year and broke up. I don't know for sure, I can ask him later, but if they dated for a year we have to assume there was at least /some/ sexual activity. He did have feelings for her /at least/. So if he has always been gay, why did he do any of this with a woman and have feelings for a woman, The feelings is critical.

I already know what you're gonna say "He wanted to keep his homosexuality a secret." Please use a different argument if you have one cause I don't buy that. If really that's the only thing you can come up with then I'll go into why I disagree. But come on, if hiding his sexuality is your only argument then I'm afraid I'm not convinced. And that's the purpose of debate after all ^.^

[Blasphemy]

I'm not a bangwagoner~

Again, I go back to the fact that he probably didn't realize he was gay at that point. However, I have another rebuttal - could he not have been feigning said emotions? See, Alex, you aren't gay. You haven't been that guy who's sitting with his girlfriend while secretly checking another man out. Likewise, you're not Ryan. Some people can fake emotions really well - and to me, that's what it sounds like he was doing.

On the other hand, many people, especially in their years of premature sexuality exploration, may think they're fully gay, only to realize they're simply bisexual. I'm a living testament of said occurrence - for nearly a year here I thought I was a lesbian. Now, I'm starting to feel a growing feeling for a man. What's that tell me? I'm not a lesbian~

Why that happens, I couldn't tell you. For me, I think I just didn't have a man that I was attracted to that way. You know full well even heterosexual people aren't attracted to every man or woman they meet. Ditto with homosexual people and bisexual people.

Regardless, sexuality can be a very up-and-down thing. Some people may seem very secure in their sexuality (and maybe, today, they are) but I can almost guarantee you that any man or woman that identifies as 'gay' has struggled with if they really are or not.

That's not to say it's not something that's predetermined within you. It's all about finding yourself, realizing what you are and what you're not.

[Hawktalon]

Jul 23, 2013 21:18:32 GMT -6 Blasphemy said:

That's not to say it's not something that's predetermined within you. It's all about finding yourself, realizing what you are and what you're not.

Completely agree, finding yourself just like everyone else. And I can understand straight to bisexual, and gay to bisexual, but Idk, the jump from straight to gay just seems so extreme. And yeah he could have been faking his emotions, I could see it, I know a guy named brandon who is similar to ryan, dated a few girls then became gay. I know a trevor who is gay but he denies it to must people to keep it a secret and he simply just doesnt date anybody. So there are two types of ways of handling I suppose.

And idk girl. Like you said Im straight so i have a hard time wrapping my head around it. I just don't see why they would go to the trouble of hiding it, especially in this day and age. Now if you go to Catholic school like me then you have the misinformed christians who are bigots for no reason then thats different. Id prob keep it secret too (Although my friend Jeff and Ryan came out and they go to my school...you know between real life and chat I have more homosexual and bisexual friends then heterosexual. XD) But if you go to public school or something like that then Idk, I wouldn't be afraid to come out. But I'm not gay/bi, so I just dont know what the thought process is when deciding to come out.

[Lilypool]

Well. I can't tell you a general answer for that, but for me, I'm still hiding it. From my family, that is. I went to public school until last year and I'm going again today. However, I can tell you, I never hid it in school. Like.. ever. When I determined to myself what I was, I was open about it. But the way I was treated, while it didn't effect me.. cause you know, hard-headed, I can see why someone wouldn't want to come out. Some people are very accepting of it, in public school and in general. However, the majority of them aren't, even in this day and age. I'd get stared at, avoided, picked-on. It didn't really effect me, I just didn't care. But it would effect some people, therefore I can understand why some people would hide it. Now, you probably don't see that happening at your school because like you said, you go to a Catholic school with kids that practice Catholicism. Catholics don't hate gays - therefore, gay people probably don't get treated like that. So.. yeah. c:

[Hawktalon]

Jul 23, 2013 21:51:11 GMT -6 Lilypool said:

Well. I can't tell you a general answer for that, but for me, I'm still hiding it. From my family, that is. I went to public school until last year and I'm going again today. However, I can tell you, I never hid it in school. Like.. ever. When I determined to myself what I was, I was open about it. But the way I was treated, while it didn't effect me.. cause you know, hard-headed, I can see why someone wouldn't want to come out. Some people are very accepting of it, in public school and in general. However, the majority of them aren't, even in this day and age. I'd get stared at, avoided, picked-on. It didn't really effect me, I just didn't care. But it would effect some people, therefore I can understand why some people would hide it. Now, you probably don't see that happening at your school because like you said, you go to a Catholic school with kids that practice Catholicism. Catholics don't hate gays - therefore, gay people probably don't get treated like that. So.. yeah. c:

None that I know have been treated badly and I know a few who have come out in the school. One of them was the Vice-President of our student council and he was /very/ flamboyant. XD Keep in mind it's also an all guy school and we all realize there's bound to be some gay people among us, And men are generally more accepting then women in my opinion.

[Lilypool]

Depends on the woman in question. Anyway.. did I convince you? c: Or at the very least put a few thoughts in your head to drive up controversy amongst your other thoughts? ^-^

[Afterpaw]

Hi, this isn't a discussion about sexuality, it's about the morality and immorality of a certain minority of a major religion, so all of you stop right now.

[Hawktalon]

Jul 29, 2013 17:18:20 GMT -6 Afterpaw said:

Hi, this isn't a discussion about sexuality, it's about the morality and immorality of a certain minority of a major religion, so all of you stop right now.

We stopped a long time ago. lol

[Afterpaw]

Jul 29, 2013 19:05:51 GMT -6 Hawktalon said:

Jul 29, 2013 17:18:20 GMT -6 Afterpaw said:

Hi, this isn't a discussion about sexuality, it's about the morality and immorality of a certain minority of a major religion, so all of you stop right now.

We stopped a long time ago. lol

SHHHHHH IT NEVER HAPPENED.